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Home Forums Evidence for Biblical miracles Naturalistic vs. spectacular supernatural Reply To: Naturalistic vs. spectacular supernatural

  • Thomas Donlon

    Member
    January 7, 2021 at 2:03 am

    I’ve yet to see the two movies on the Red Sea Crossing. My tight finances combined with my desire to get all the extra material in the Collectors Editions contributed to this decision to wait. However now that the Collectors Edition of the first of the films came out. I ordered it. But tracking indicates it has been stuck for a few weeks awaiting processing at a backed up postal facility. And so I wait. I’d like to get more info and came close to ordering Dr. Fritz’s books, I’ve held off repeatedly on that too. However I can say that the gulf of Aqaba according to my independent knowledge is part of a rift zone (where the earth is pulling apart). That means the area is spreading and hence sinking. (Some rift zones have magma coming to surface and make volcanoes other areas sink.) The Dead Sea just to the North is the lowest point on land on earth because of tectonic rifting. I can’t rule out some further rifting activity sucked down a bunch of water in the gulf of Aqaba into the ground. Not sure whether that angle was covered in the film or not. By itself it is a lot to ask for a rift event alone to move back a thousand feet of water. Yet the bible speaks of a wall. How high was that? Growing up on the coast I’m also familiar with waves crashing and creating walls of water where they hit. I’m not saying that was the case I’m just speculating. The Egyptians also complained that God was turning their chariot wheels. I’m not sure what that meant. Earthquake activity? Maybe the land bridge (typically underwater) was closer to the surface at that time and during the crossing the dirt started sliding deeper away, particularly as the tectonic zone could have sucked in more dirt and maybe a landslide while the Egyptians were crossing (or subsequently) decreased the height of the land bridge also making that crossing seem like a harder miracle for God to have performed. The land bridge in the past across the Aqaba might have been higher. Any number of possibilities.

    However there are other miracles in the Bible that involve the sun. One of them was as a sign to Hezekiah when the sun went back seven steps it had gone down. God didn’t put the whole earth on a rewind. Later when the Babylonian envoys came to visit the recuperated Hezekiah they asked about the miracle that “had occurred in the land.”

    Another miracle that is astonishing is when Joshua told the sun and the moon to stand still and it did for about a day. Yet during this time a battle was raging and God threw down massive hail stones that killed more of the enemy than the Israelites did. Question: was the sun visible during this time? This is more massive than any storm I’ve been through in my life time. So there may have been either a massive thunder storm so big that you wouldn’t even see the sun and moon, or this was a cluster of icy comet debri from out of space. In either case whether from the extreme electrical activity of a more localized storm giving light (and then clearing up a day later) or icy (even perhaps methane ice mixed in) comet debri heating up the sky enough to give light or some such thing that would both cloud up the sky and cause it to glow. I’m not giving an answer. I just know that the Israelites couldn’t have had their eyes on the sun and the moon during this time that the sky was pelting down all this material. And the Bible doesn’t say when the sky was cloudy and when it cleared up in this particular event. So in this case I’m going with overcast sky during the whole time and some form of naturalistic lighting. Even strong sun flare activity can create strong auroras that light the sky at lower latitudes. Though many of us are familiar with the glowing sky during the Carrington Event there are records in history of even stronger solar flares, solar storms hitting the earth. And astronomically such things happen on other stars too. Again a bright night that might have seemed like an adequate fulfillment of Joshua’s request which was to extend the day so he could keep on fighting.

    The timing of events in the Book of Esther has no mention of God intervening or doing anything at all. Yet we see his hand. Another example, further back in time in the Northern Kingdom of Israel, Ahab died because someone shot an arrow at random. Yet the prophecy of Micaiah showed this was God’s intention all along.

    I suppose I could go on. We don’t understand science itself yet. We moderns act like we do but when it comes to things like quantum entanglement(?) or the existence of dark matter and dark energy, science is still unsure about all this. Most of stuff in the universe scientists say we don’t understand. Talk about matter fluctuating in and out of existence in “quantum fluctuations” … at least I don’t understand this stuff. Our universe has evidence of design. Even atheists say the universe has “the appearance of design.” Some scientists also suggest (though I don’t believe this) that other universes pop in and out of existence in these fluctuations. Which leads to the idea of us creating new universes. But if a universe can be created can’t it be then be entered into by its creator? If you can make something then you can modify it. So if God can make a universe he can enter into it or do whatever he wants in it. This leaves me wondering how anyone who believes a universe can be made by a super-intelligent being could turn around and say there is no such being that made our universe and also that miracles are impossible.

    Shifting gears again. Just to toss some humor into this comment. There is as story about a poor widow in her house crying out to God to “send bread.” Some kids going by thought it would be funny to throw some bread through her open window into her house. Of course, the widow thanks God and the kids try without success to convince the widow the bread didn’t come from God but just from them. Of course we can say God used both. Paul talks about government officials doing God’s work. People might complain at times about the government doing this or that unjustly but rarely do people give thanks that total anarchy (the absence of Government) isn’t dominating our society.

    So maybe this comment doesn’t answer much. However, God can use many methods to do his will. Paul the apostle, said in a speech to some unbelievers that God did things like send them food and joy.

    Maybe we get used to the normal miracles. The way the body works. The way the sun gives light, heat and energy to the earth. Understanding these things is just as amazing as the seas splitting apart. But if the sea just split apart randomly we’d just have a weird phenomenon. But if this happens in a context of God’s hand being revealed to protect his fleeing people it has meaning and shows his love.

    Some day I might write about the Burckle crater and its speculated correlation with Noah’s flood. I believe it, but I don’t have a bunch of scientific evidence for it really hasn’t been researched. A bit like some of the top Israeli archaeologists who believe we are “past” looking for evidence of Biblical ancient Israel, research regarding Noah’s flood has fallen out of professional academic favor among archaeologists which makes it hard to examine the scope of that flood on the land. The crater itself in the Indian ocean (12,500 feet deep or so) and eighteen miles wide or so (from memory I’m writing) hasn’t been explored. Tantalizing little bits of stuff found here and there were available to look at that give some supporting evidence for this.