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Home Forums Evidence for Biblical miracles In this society, how is something recognized as a miracle?

  • In this society, how is something recognized as a miracle?

  • Michele Rousseau

    Member
    February 1, 2021 at 7:40 am

    If I or anyone here thought that they witnessed a miracle and considered sharing the experience here, what would the evidence need to be for a general consensus of affirmation that, “Yes! That was truly a miracle!” ??? Miracles can happen on a personal level, like the oil that never ran dry for the widow who obeyed Elijah in the drought (1 Kings 17:12-14), or they can happen on a grand scale of a whole nation witnessing the parting of the Red Sea (Nehemiah 9:9-11). What would be considered a miracle in HFS?

  • Thomas Donlon

    Member
    April 7, 2021 at 10:43 pm

    Hi Michele,

    You wrote,

    If I or anyone here thought that they witnessed a miracle and considered
    sharing the experience here, what would the evidence need to be for a
    general consensus….What would be considered a
    miracle in HFS?

    Hi Michele,

    This is truly a new society where people who have interests in the historical underpinnings of scripture have joined for our own individual reasons. Some of us joined to have access to information that might build our faith. Some of us joined to share our faith. We have no common background or common religious heritage. Some are firmly Young Earth Creationists and some believe in “deep time” and an ancient creation. And within those camps view vary.

    Some have a much higher regard for the Ten Commandments here and enjoy more specifics of the religious heritage given to the Jews and ancient Israel, and some people think the Old Testament teachings was somehow subsumed or fulfilled by Jesus and the new/old Commandments are to love one another and love God with all… of everything.

    For me, the challenge in accepting whether something that happened to someone is a “miracle” is difficult because I’m not necessarily inclined to believe every person that comes along and tells a story about something that happened to him or her. I don’t need to know. If God chooses to perform a miracle for someone, He might have had a purpose. It could conceivably be 1) to help that particular person, 2) For that person to tell someone else and encourage that other person.

    To me it doesn’t really matter. God does all kinds of miracles, sustains the universe, keeps us alive, gives us insight, helps us sometimes to serve Him or others.

    In some circles, it is well known that “wolves in sheep clothing” try to portray or fake miracles so that they can get money from people.

    I personally don’t bother with the question.

    At one time the apostles/disciples of Jesus were all excited that they were able to cast out evil spirits and all that. Jesus told them not to rejoice over that but rather that their names were written in heaven.

    Another time the people came to Jesus asking him for a sign and Jesus said “a wicked and adulteress generations seeketh after sign and none will be given it accept the sign of the prophet Jonah.” And yet even Jesus appearance was to a select few, maybe five hundred or a bit more. The rest of the people just wrestled with the fact a tomb that was guarded by soldiers was empty and the soldiers claimed to have fell asleep, yet fingered the disciples as stealing the body.

    You might enjoy reading 1st Samuel chapters 4 through 6. The Philistines were trying to figure out what whether what was happening to them was divine intervention or not.

    Over all, though your question is huge. Some good discussion from some HFS members took place on a different forum titled “Naturalistic vs Spectacularly Supernatural.”

    Seeing God intervene is exciting, but sometimes it might be more subjective, personal and other times what God does can not really be differentiated from chance. 2 Chronicles 18: with the key verse I’m pointing out being verse 33.

    People on this forum have different ideas of how and when God made everything and all life. “Random” is a hard question. In the case of the death of Ahab, an arrow penetrated a small gap between his armor. Ahab went to the battle in disguise. Statistically he probably should have been safe. Something happened though that defied probability. Yet scripture is clear that God somehow had this all arranged.

    If you read the book of Esther, you will not find God mentioned. Yet it is hard to read it without seeing God’s hand in saving the Jews from extermination. What rules though can you apply to say whether any specific thing that happened in the book was a miracle. You will probably also enjoy reading the Book of Esther.

    Tell me what you think after looking at those scriptures, if you have any additional thoughts or questions.

    In Christ,

    Tom

  • Michele Rousseau

    Member
    April 8, 2021 at 1:55 pm

    Hello Tom, and thank you for your reply. Truthfully, I had tried to delete my question after I posted it, but couldn’t. I had looked at other questions on the forum and considered mine to be, perhaps, redundant to others.

    Regarding Esther, I really enjoy the book of Esther and just celebrated the Purim feast of Esther and watched the Sight and Sound broadcast of their play Esther. At your suggestion, I will read it again because I want to see anything new and deeper that the Lord might be wanting me to see.

    True, I agree that a miracle can be quite personal to build a person’s faith, or it can be witnessed by a whole nation to save an entire nation!!!! God is so good! I guess some things can be seen as a miracle by some that others may take for granted, like a baby’s birth, or how the Earth spins on its axis every day and night. I’m sure Einstein recognized many miracles in his studies. What a dear and gifted man, fearfully and wonderfully made, as are we all!

    Thanks again, Tom. So nice to meet you and read your thoughts about my question. I will check out the scriptures you mentioned in your reply.

    Many blessings and shalom!

    Michele

  • Thomas Donlon

    Member
    April 9, 2021 at 2:11 am

    Hi Michele,

    I recollect being passionate about sections of the Bible and reading and rereading certain books or letters in it day after day for quite a while. There is value sometimes in rereading some portions of scriptures. I’m pleased to see your love for scripture.

    I was wondering how to respond about what you said about Einstein. I’ve got the fortune/misfortune of seeing people on many different levels. His scientific insights were immense. Yet other stories suggest that he lacked some aptitude in other areas. Some of the stories are rather funny … but dear.

    Among the over 9,000 people on the HFS society is George Barna who was famous for polling and a lot of high level social research studies. I just found that one of his few HFS connections is to HFS thinker Matt Brown. Matt’s HFS profile shares that he hosts a podcast and I decided to explore it. I just spent about 35 minutes listening to one podcast, whose description caught my attention.

    https://www.accessmore.com/episode/Ep-32-Dr-G-shares-how-science-can-lead-us-to-God

    Matt Brown interviewed this Dr. G. This is a conversion story of an atheist, scientist and I’m interested to listen some more to Dr. G. for he has his own podcast. Matt described his interview with Dr. G. and Dr G’s background the following way.

    <div>”Do you ever wonder about how science and God can fit together? My guest today is Dr. G. He has taught science at Harvard, has been a featured scientist on ABC News, Good Morning America, Nightline, 20/20 and World News Tonight for many years, and in the process he has won 3 Emmys. His story about how his love for science led him to faith in God is one you won’t want to miss.”</div><div>

    </div>

    The interview is a little on the lines of some of what Tim featured regarding John Lennox. For those that enjoyed that type of science they should also enjoy the podcast linked above. He has a more interesting conversion story though. He didn’t grow up Christian he actually studied a bunch of other religions and had almost no interest in studying Christianity because he thought Christians were anti-science. But someone wanted to read the Bible … and he accepted the invitation to join in. And his motives initially was not a real curiosity about the Bible. I’m not sure I fully understand the conversion that he went through, but I think I’ll want to learn more about the Dr. G.

    I think I’m fortunate that the HFS society has opened up a lot of doors for me to learn different things and connect with a number of gifted people.

    Yet I’ve got so much more to learn… but His blessings of knowledge and grace are immense.

    May God guide you in all your learning and service, … blessings in the heavenly realms.

  • Michele Rousseau

    Member
    April 13, 2021 at 2:44 pm

    Thank you. And many blessings to you!

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